Sounds Great! The NV35 is an FX derived product and will have better performance and more features(they claim), it’s previously been planned for the second half of 2003. The sooner they bring it out the better. Seems like when thay factor in ATI’s planned introduction of their next product they don’t expect to sell many of the current FX parts. They’re only talking about a ~6 month window for this product against stiff competition from ATI, so this does seem credible. 100,000 units in 6 months then onto the next big thing.
[This message has been edited by dorbie (edited 02-08-2003).]
Originally posted by dorbie: Often reviewers opinions are colored by personal slights by marketing/PR and you never get to see that, (not talking about the inquirer) I heard a tale of one engineer at a GFX company punching a very famous reviewer, OK that’s more than a ‘slight’, the guy was totally anti-that company from then on. Another incident with the same guy was that he was pissed off with another company because they didn’t fly him first class and dissed them for ages after that.
Sounds like cool soap opera.
All reviewers are pretty much influenced by companies. I’m sure they get free offers, perhaps a nice new car on and who knows what.
It’s your job to filter out the crap.
About what the Inquirer said, I was thinking that myself when I read that ATI will be releasing the R350 at the end of Feb 2003 as NV said they would release the NV30 at the beginining of Feb 2003.
I just looked at the prices. The R300 still sells for 600$CAN + ?? Not much of a price drop since it’s release. 800$ would be the price of a brand new tower + 17 inch screen (with a low end video card).
That’s a local store. Price watch shows much cheaper stuff.
All reviewers are pretty much influenced by companies. I’m sure they get free offers, perhaps a nice new car on and who knows what.
Where do I become a reviewer? Sign me up!
Seriously, I think reviewers get free hardware (to review), and perhaps promo material like T-shirts and party invitations and stuff. However, to get a carm you’d probably have to be reviewing something like hedge funds, AND have the eary of half of all billionaires in the states or something…
As far as I know, pricewatch.com is the official measurement for “street price.”
nVidia looks like a looser if/when it does so, but it still is a good move. At least in the context of their current situation. Don’t know about the new features of R350, but surely if the NV35 adds more capabillities to the original NV30 and a more quite fan AND is realesed, at maximum, shortly after the R350 will go into production, nVidia might just have the chance of recapturing the market. But I doubt nVidia will be able to be so quick. Personally, this is a big fuss cirucus and I’m actually looking forward to what S3 can offer.
I would have to say that im upset w/ this “no Ultra” version of the NV30! I have been waiting for it for some time now. I have the first version of geforce3 and have been waiting to upgrade. I waited for this card assuming that it would come out soon after the 9700 pro. I have no idea why nvidia would release the nv30 to reviewers when they knew about the sound issue and such. Now i hear is that the nv35 is coming and i hear about the possible features. Is this another lie? I would prefer not to wait another 4 months to get my hands on a new card including after the R350 comes out. They better hurry up and release the specs soon if they want me to put any money down for a nv35!
I don’t know much about video cards (I have a GF4 Ti 4400), but this thread has piqued my interest. When I bought the GF4 it seemed to be generally agreed that nVidia support for Linux was the best. How good are the ATi Linux drivers?
Originally posted by Lurking: I would have to say that im upset w/ this “no Ultra” version of the NV30! I have been waiting for it for some time now. I have the first version of geforce3 and have been waiting to upgrade. I waited for this card assuming that it would come out soon after the 9700 pro. I have no idea why nvidia would release the nv30 to reviewers when they knew about the sound issue and such. Now i hear is that the nv35 is coming and i hear about the possible features. Is this another lie? I would prefer not to wait another 4 months to get my hands on a new card including after the R350 comes out. They better hurry up and release the specs soon if they want me to put any money down for a nv35!
Good point, how do we know this isn’t just more bs propaganda from nv to take the steam out of the ati 350 release? The nv35 will probably just end up being released this time next year… meanwhile all the nv owners (self included) have held out waiting.
now its only up to a couple weeks to find out were my money is going. I love nvidia for its developer and driver support. but now they way they are saying we have the best but we cant tell you when its coming out or that we canelled it has me thinking. So im hoping 2 weeks after the r350 is released that nvidia come up with the specs for this nv35. I buy a new graphics card every year to year and a half and i want to make sure for about 400 dollars my money is going to be spent well. So nvidia please help us out!
If it weren’t for a nice effort from ATI you’d be mightily impressed by NV30. If you like it get it, the reviews are in and it ain’t going to be **** canned instantly. It looks to be slightly faster than the current ATI for some interesting stuff, with some really great features. The info (RUMOUR) says there will be 100,000 of the chips made by TSMC. Gainward seems to have a card sans blower on the way.
Are the current cards so awful that you don’t want to splurge for them? BFD wait for the next ATI, or the next NVIDIA. The NV35 has been on the roadmap for a long time, it’s not a short term effort to hurt ATI.
It’s strange that you invite NVIDIA to leak their next gen before their current product is on the shelves. I doubt they’d do that quite just yet. Heck you’re getting your panties in a wad because of a rumoured ATI release, and you want MORE futures?
You just want these guys to make your life easy by giving you a clear leader, and that ain’t happening right now. This is a GOOD thing for us, not a BAD thing. Get over it, spin a bottle, flip a coin, buy a card… or wait, who cares. Just don’t blame the companies for playing exactly the game we want them to play…leapfrog.
You’re able to buy the fastest most featureful graphics systems there are or have ever been for a few hundred bucks and you’re still not happy?
Often reviewers opinions are colored by personal slights by marketing/PR and you never get to see that, (not talking about the inquirer) I heard a tale of one engineer at a GFX company punching a very famous reviewer, OK that’s more than a ‘slight’, the guy was totally anti-that company from then on. Another incident with the same guy was that he was pissed off with another company because they didn’t fly him first class and dissed them for ages after that.
I don’t really consider that a valid reason for believing or disbelieving a review. All a good review, and a good reviewer, needs to do is present an argument for a particular position. Having read the reviews on Anandtech, I would say that they put up very good arguments. Occasionally, they leave out certain fact, or get some things wrong, but that’s the exception.
How good a review is is simply based on how good the argument is. If a reviewer is out to get a particular companies products, it’s usually easy to spot and disregard; the argument will be full of holes.
I would prefer not to wait another 4 months to get my hands on a new card including after the R350 comes out. They better hurry up and release the specs soon if they want me to put any money down for a nv35!
Good point, how do we know this isn’t just more bs propaganda from nv to take the steam out of the ati 350 release? The nv35 will probably just end up being released this time next year… meanwhile all the nv owners (self included) have held out waiting.
So im hoping 2 weeks after the r350 is released that nvidia come up with the specs for this nv35. I buy a new graphics card every year to year and a half and i want to make sure for about 400 dollars my money is going to be spent well. So nvidia please help us out!
The anti-ATi sentiment is strong in this thread. I mean, you have a product in the 9700 Pro that is approximately equal to the competing nVidia product released 5 months later. And yet, here are three intelligent, capable programmers, and none of you even consider picking up a 9700 or an R350 card. It’s always about nVidia giving you want you want when you want it, when ATi provided this service to some people months ago. Why is that?
Anandtech are one of the better review sites IMHO too.
Yes you can spot the holes in biased reviews if you’re equipped to.
I have a 9700, it’s the most incredible graphics system I’ve ever owned. Simply amazing, I highly recommend it, the next version due real soon now should be even better.
FWIW I think the issue for the others is that GeForce FX merely catches the 9700 Pro and perhaps noses ahead instead of spanking it. This gives everyone pause because of the timing. If they’re buying NOW they are thinking they might as well wait on the next ATI due soon which they expect to take a decisive lead. Compounding their dilema is the NV30 ‘dead in the water’ bull5hit/hysteria because NVIDIA’s NV35 is still on the roadmap for later this year.
NV30 may be the shortest lived GFX product from NVIDIA simply because they need to stay on track with NV35 to compete with ATI.
All reasonabe, all sensible. But it’s all GREAT for us dumb programmers freeloading on their hardware battle. Sit back & enjoy the show, and remember, whatever you buy will be obsolete in short order.
[This message has been edited by dorbie (edited 02-10-2003).]
Originally posted by Korval: none of you even consider picking up a 9700 or an R350 card. Why is that?
The main reason I’m sticking with NVidia ( for the time being) is that they seem to be first with the extensions I find most useful. Point Sprites, occlusion query, VAR(VAO), PDR.
Another reason is that since there are more NV people out there(I think) and I can only test on one card it makes sense to have the type of card most people have.
[This message has been edited by Adrian (edited 02-10-2003).]
The main reason I’m sticking with NVidia ( for the time being) is that they seem to be first with the extensions I find most useful. Point Sprites, occlusion query, VAR(VAO), PDR.
I guess it depends on the extensions you find most useful, but for one, i loved the 1.4 pixel shader extension on the 8500, and now the 9700 has ARB_fragment_program, which is not available on the GF3/GF4. My point being, there’s also some good extensions on ATI you know…
Another reason is that since there are more NV people out there(I think) and I can only test on one card it makes sense to have the type of card most people have.
Probably true but… i’d be interested to see a poll about which video card everybody has… seems like a lot of programmers have moved to ATI this last year (with reasons i have to add).
Y.
[This message has been edited by Ysaneya (edited 02-11-2003).]
I too have an R9700, bought it as soon as I knew that GFFX would be released only in the beginning of 2003 (and I got my hands on it). And it suplied the minumum requirements for the DX9 specs (for which I mostly code), and it was already available. So why not? It’s a good card, with a lot of power and functionality that will last for about another ½-1 years =) And with a copper cooler (or what ever) on the chip, it purrs like a kitten, not that 70 dB sound, which the like of you might only hear from the heavy music listening neighbour that has bought a one size too big sound system
Originally posted by Ysaneya: Probably true but… i’d be interested to see a poll about which video card everybody has… seems like a lot of programmers have moved to ATI this last year (with reasons i have to add).
In fact, I have been at nVidia’s The Dawn To Dusk conference, this week, where a Geforce FX card were promised for every attendee and, there, they told us they don’t have them available. So we have to wait some weeks and they will send them to us.
Ramon.
My GF2 is the only video card I’ve owned that I haven’t had any problems with and yes I have owned an ati card along time ago (All-in-wonder rage pro). I’m sure their stuff is better now, but if you feel you’ve paid for sh*t before it stays with you. As for the r300 I might have picked one up last summer if I was ready to upgrade. Getting one now is pointless, in a few months the r350 will be out and either the r300 will drop in price or the r350 will be worth the extra money. My concern is that nv will claim that the nv35 will be out at any moment causing people that prefer nv to wait and that ‘any moment’ will probably turn into 12 months.
Originally posted by gib: I don’t know much about video cards (I have a GF4 Ti 4400), but this thread has piqued my interest. When I bought the GF4 it seemed to be generally agreed that nVidia support for Linux was the best. How good are the ATi Linux drivers?
Yeah, I have to laugh about all the driver instability talk. The nVidia drivers for Linux are absolutely solid. I can’t remember the last time an app locked due to a bad driver. It’s usually me doing something stupid and a bunch of glGetErrors usually solves the problem. I can just kill the app anyway. I don’t have to worry about BSODs or reboots. I haven’t even had to reboot the last x number of times I installed new nVidia drivers. Part of this has to do with the fact that loadable kernel modules and xfree are quite stable.
I am spoiled now. I get annoyed with XP for having to reboot every time I install or uninstall an app or driver.
Right now I’m doing almost all my coding in Linux. I spend an hour or two at the end of the week to port to Windows. Which is still a win for me in productivity.
That’s why I am hesitant to purchase an ATI card. nVidia have made a commitment to Linux and IMHO the jury is still out for ATI’s drivers.
IMHO hardware vs hardware is a pretty moot argument for nVidia vs ATI. What I look for is solid drivers and extensions with ease of programming.
Yeah, nVidia has a poop load of proprietary extensions, but their dev support makes up for it.
In fact, I have been at nVidia’s The Dawn To Dusk conference, this week, where a Geforce FX card were promised for every attendee and, there, they told us they don’t have them available. So we have to wait some weeks and they will send them to us.
Ramon.
hehe! Some things never change. It was exactly the same at the Gathering event, where we were supposed to pick up our GF3’s. They didn’t arrive till months later. Mine was duff too, but it got exchanged.
It was exactly the same at the Gathering event, where we were supposed to pick up our GF3’s. They didn’t arrive till months later. Mine was duff too, but it got exchanged.