I think he wants you to flame him and he enjoys reading the flames. Can’t you see he’s intentionally trying to provoke you!?!
Btw. excuse my English…
This C++ guy is really crazy!
I have to disagree with these:
1.) You act dumb, you get flamed.
2.) You ask dumb questions, you get flamed
I think I’ve violated these terms in the past, but you were still kind and helpful. I’ve never been flamed on here (not that I care much if/when I do…)
Originally posted by kansler:
C++ must be the biggest comedian in Russia.
Indeed. How about this one, posted in April 14, 2003:
http://www.opengl.org.ru/cgi-bin/ultra/UltraBoard.cgi?action=Read&BID=1&TID=6400&SID= 6208
thread title:"×òî äåëàòü, ÷òîáû íà÷àòü ðàáîòàòü ñ OpenGL? ß èñïîëüçóþ ÿçûê Ñ++ "
message body: “×òî äåëàòü, ÷òîáû íà÷àòü ðàáîòàòü ñ OpenGL? ß èñïîëüçóþ ÿçûê Ñ++.
Ãäå âçÿòü áèáëèîòåêó OpenGL, êàê åå íàñòðîèòü?
Äðóçüÿ, ïîñîâåòóéòå èëè ïîäñêàæèòå ññûëêó íà êîðîòåíüêóþ äîêó?”
OK, now let me translate it(in my own humble way, of course. If C++ doesn’t like this translation – we always could ask him to do his own 
). OK, here we go(just a small note: prepare to have paper bag, 'coz you won’t like it )
thread title:“What do i have to do to start working with OpenGL? I use C++ language.”
message body: “What do i have to do to start working with OpenGL? I use C++ language.Where do i get the OpenGL library, and how to tune it out?
Friends, do suggest or prompt me a link to a short doc.”
So, i think this last “Friends…” sentence has some distinctive communication feature of our buddy, doesn’t it?
[This message has been edited by matt_weird (edited 07-02-2003).]
[This message has been edited by matt_weird (edited 07-02-2003).]
Ok, some answers here are not so cool, but maybe I can ask this:
It’s something with which API is more low level.
-
OpenGL supports quads and polygons, DX supports triangles only. OpenGL supports linewidth, DX doesn’t. I’m not sure, how OpenGL achieves this, but it must “map” the quads to tris and with the linewidth I have no idea?
-
When you use vertex buffers in DX, is it like VAR/VAO in ogl?
In 1. DX looks lower level. In 2. ogl looks lower level. Plus, DX comes with HLSL.
Please don’t flame, I’m just asking,
Mete
Matt_weird!
Íåóæåëè òû äóìàåøü ÷òî òàêóþ òóïîñòü íàïèñàë ÿ (Ýòî â íàòóðå òóïî)? À ÷òî òû â ñâî¸ âðåìÿ ïèñàë â ôîðóìàõ ÷òîáû óçíàòü êàê èñïîëüçîâàòü OpenGL (Íàâåðíÿêà âñÿêóþ áàòâó)? È åù¸. Òâîé ïåðåâîä - îòñòîé.
Mete Ciragan!
Never say what you doesnt know! D3D supports width of lines since DX 8.1. Yes, D3D isnt supporting quads. Its good. Quads requre additional CPU work (not GPU). About VAR/VAO. I didnt absolute understood what you mean by this. Probably you talking about dynamic modify vertex buffers without recreating. It also supports by D3D.
Aaron!
I don`t know about others, but YOU are really monkey.
Can you show me the linewidth thing in DX? I’m using DX9 at the moment. I just can find the ID3DXLine, but that one accepts already projected points only. Linewidth seems easier in OpenGL to me.
If I read correctly about VAO/VAR/VBO, the vertex/index arrays are stored in AGP or video memory. With DX it is actually easier to render vertices from AGP mem using the vertex buffers. glVertexPointer/glDrawElement/glDrawArrays are like DrawPrimitiveUP, right? For me it’s easier to render vertex arrays fast in DX, because I don’t have to mess with different code paths like in Ogl. I know, I’m a lazy n00b.
I knew, you can easily lock/unlock vertex buffers in DX.
Btw, I don’t use quads/polys anyway. I render me edges using a line list (GL_LINES). This seems to be faster than rendering the model using a line fillmode/polygonmode.
Btw: who wants to render a single primitive anyway?
- Mete
[This message has been edited by Mete Ciragan (edited 07-02-2003).]
Originally posted by C++:
Matt_weird!
Íåóæåëè òû äóìàåøü ÷òî òàêóþ òóïîñòü íàïèñàë ÿ (Ýòî â íàòóðå òóïî)?
Ïî-êðàéíåé ìåðå, êòî-òî ïîëüçîâàë òâîé íèê. È ýòîò êòî-òî ïîõîæå òîæå èç Ïèòåðà… È ýòîò êòî-òî òîæå èñïîëüçóåò îáðàùåíèÿ òèïà “Äðóçüÿ/Friends”… Äàëüøå â ýòîì ïëàíå ïðîäîëæàòü íå áóäó.
Originally posted by C++:
À ÷òî òû â ñâî¸ âðåìÿ ïèñàë â ôîðóìàõ ÷òîáû óçíàòü êàê èñïîëüçîâàòü OpenGL (Íàâåðíÿêà âñÿêóþ áàòâó)?
×óâàê çàø¸ë íà ñàéò, ãäå ïðÿìî ïåðåä ññûëêîé íà ôîðóì åñòü ññûëêà íà äîêóìåíòàöèþ, ãäå åñòü âñå íåîáõîäèìûå ïîÿñíåíèÿ íàñ÷¸ò ïîëüçîâàíèÿ áèáëèîòåêîé, ïëþñ êíèãà äëÿ íà÷èíàþùèõ.
 ñâî¸ âðåìÿ ÿ ñòàðàëñÿ íå ïèñàòü áàòâó íà ôîðóìàõ – â êîíöå-êîíöîâ, ÷¸ ìåøàåò èñïîëüçîâàòü ïîèñê â èíåòå ïåðåä òåì êàê çàäàâàòü ãëóïûå âîïðîñû, íà êîòîðûå óæå ñòî ðàç áûë äàí îòâåò, à òàêæå ÷èòàòü îôèöèàëüíûå ñïåêè. È äëÿ íà÷àëà õîòÿ áû êíèãè äëÿ íà÷èíàþùèõ.
Originally posted by C++:
È åù¸. Òâîé ïåðåâîä - îòñòîé.
“Your translation - sucks.” Well, as i said, you can always do your own one, if you want – and we’ll then see
One more thing: people actually asked you some questions – are you going to answer 'em? In fact, i asked you to name those russian experts, who clame all the stuff you say they claim. After all, that weren’t russians who developed any of these API’s, as well as all the hardware and OS’s these API’s are working on.
Guys, please stop feeding the troll.
Originally posted by C++:
Never say what you doesn`t know!
So, you say my translation sucks, rigth?
Matt_weird!
Íàñ÷åò ìîåãî “äâîéíèêà”. Íà ñàìîì äåëå ÿ íè ðàçó íå ñîçäàâàë òîïèê íà OpenGL.RU (Òîëüêî ïîñåùàë ðàçîê).
Ñîãëàñåí. Never say what you doesn`t know! - ïåðåâåäåíî ãëóïî è ïîñïåøíî (Çàáûë ïðîâåðèòü ñìûñë). Õîòåë ñêàçàòü: Íèêîãäà íå ãîâîðè òîãî ÷åãî íå çíàåøü (Ïåðåâîä ñëîâî â ñëîâî, íî ñìûñë îñòàëñÿ â äàë¸êîé Àìåðèêå).
So, you say my translation sucks, rigth?
Âî ïåðâûõ íå say, à said - ïîòîìó ÷òî ÿ íå ãîâîðþ ÷òî òâîé ïåðåâîä îòñòîé, à ãîâîðÈË.
Íå rigth, à right - íàâåðíîå ïîñïåøèë.
Mete Ciragan
Linewidth in D3D 9.0:
ID3DXLine::SetGLLines
and then
ID3DXLine::SetWidth
You must have more practice in english reading.
Matt_weird, ñêàæè ïîæàëóñòà, êàê ïî-àíãëèéñêè íàïèñàòü:
“Çàòêíèñü, Korval, ïîãàíûé óðîä. Ñàì íè÷åãî óìíîãî íå äîáàâèë â ýòó òåìó à åù¸ òóò âûñòóïàåò. Êàê æàëêî ÷òî ÿ íå ìîãó ïëþíóòü òåáå â ðîæó ÷åðåç Èíòåðíåò.”
Matt. Ãäå â èíòåðíåòå ÿ ìîãó äîñòàòü ïîäðîáíûé ñëîâàðü íåöåíçóðíûõ âûðàæåíèé RUS->ENG? Ïðîñòî â ìî¸ì ñëîâàðå íåò òàêèõ ñëîâ. È åù¸. Âîïðîñ. Êàêèå ïðîãðàììû ñ èñïîëüçîâàíèåì Direct3D/OpenGL òû óæå ñîçäàë çà âñ¸ âðåìÿ èçó÷åíèÿ ãðàôèêè (Ñàìûå ëó÷øèå òâîè ïðèìåðû)? + Ñêîëüêî ëåò òû óæå çíàêîì ñ ÎïåíÃË/Äèðåêò3Ä?
I did not know that somebody here (except C++) could read or write “Moron”.
I stand corrected.
Originally posted by C++:
Never say what you doesn`t know!
Oh the irony…
Originally posted by C++:
Matt_weird!So, you say my translation sucks, rigth?
Âî ïåðâûõ íå say, à said - ïîòîìó ÷òî ÿ íå ãîâîðþ ÷òî òâîé ïåðåâîä îòñòîé, à ãîâîðÈË.
Íå rigth, à right - íàâåðíîå ïîñïåøèë.
Çíà÷èò òû øóòêó c ïåðåâîäîì âñ¸ æå íå ïîíÿë “Äûê, çíà÷èò ãðèøü ìîé ïåðåâîä ñîñ¸ò, òàê?” – â ãðóáîé ôîðìå. À áóêâû h è t ïåðåïóòàë óìûøëåííî èìåííî øóòêè ðàäè.
Originally posted by C++:
Matt_weird, ñêàæè ïîæàëóñòà, êàê ïî-àíãëèéñêè íàïèñàòü:
“Çàòêíèñü, Korval, ïîãàíûé óðîä. Ñàì íè÷åãî óìíîãî íå äîáàâèë â ýòó òåìó à åù¸ òóò âûñòóïàåò. Êàê æàëêî ÷òî ÿ íå ìîãó ïëþíóòü òåáå â ðîæó ÷åðåç Èíòåðíåò.”
C++ asked to translate: “Shut up, Korval, inedible freak. Nothing clever added, but he managed to show off. How pity that i cannot spit you in the face via Internet”
C++: Next time i’ll find you and i’ll get you to pay me for the translation. And if you don’t – i’ll beat you 'till you dead! :joke:
Originally posted by C++:
Matt. Ãäå â èíòåðíåòå ÿ ìîãó äîñòàòü ïîäðîáíûé ñëîâàðü íåöåíçóðíûõ âûðàæåíèé RUS->ENG? Ïðîñòî â ìî¸ì ñëîâàðå íåò òàêèõ ñëîâ.
Íå çíàþ, íè ðàçó íå âèäåë. È óæ ëó÷øå áû òû íå íàø¸ë. “You must have more practice in english reading.”
Originally posted by C++:
È åù¸. Âîïðîñ. Êàêèå ïðîãðàììû ñ èñïîëüçîâàíèåì Direct3D/OpenGL òû óæå ñîçäàë çà âñ¸ âðåìÿ èçó÷åíèÿ ãðàôèêè (Ñàìûå ëó÷øèå òâîè ïðèìåðû)? + Ñêîëüêî ëåò òû óæå çíàêîì ñ ÎïåíÃË/Äèðåêò3Ä?
Âî áëèí, ÿ óæå âòîðîé ðàç ñâîé âîïðîñ ïîâòîðèë, ïîâòîðÿþ òðåòèé ðàç: íàçîâè ýêñïåðòîâ êîòîðûå òàì ÷òî-òî óòâåðæäàþò ïðî API, ïîèì¸ííî. À òû óìóäðÿåøüñÿ ñâîè âîïðîñû çàäàâàòü.  êîíöå-òî êîíöîâ ýòî òû ñîçäàë ýòó íèòü â ôîðóìå, òåáå íàäî áûëî ÷òî-òî äîêàçàòü – âîò è äîêàçûâàé, îòâå÷àé íà âîïðîñû.
Çàâàëèòå HMMMMMMMM…
Where are the moderators 
Çàâàëèòå HMMMMMMMM…
Where are the moderators
Originally posted by M/\dm/
:
Where are the moderators
well, i think this board is intentionally kept without moderators – am i wrong? You see, the overall website is pretty up to date(news, downloads, etc), so that it wouldn’t be a problem to assign a moderator i think. But no, there’s none. Just think about it: what if somebody from the posters will be appointed with moderator rights? Everybody then will start begging, like “ban him off! delete his stuff! give me some food! change my pampers!” Everyone will be feeling just somewhat strange with all that.
Consider, for example, C++ member will be banned off, or at least some of his posts will be deleted. So what? What’s the problem with creating a new account and/or posting some new thread with the same content?
I personally think that it should be solved at once this time, otherwise it’ll continue forever.
And i guess i asked C++ the right question of naming the experts, and if he will continue ignoring this one – that will show that his info is inconsistent and has nothing to do with the truth.
Also, i can understand the ATI/nVidia rant, because there could be some people from both companies reading all this stuff and making up a conclusion. Plus, after all, “ATI/nVidia” question sounds more like “What kind of food would you like to have for a breakfast?” , meanwhile the “OpenGL/Direct3D” question sonds like “What do you belive in?” And when someone is trying to say something like “your ‘religion’ sucks, because it sucks with no reason”, it’s like someone is saying “Your Bible sucks, guys, because that wasn’t me who wrote it. Therefore i don’t even want to read it. It just simply ain’t worth it”
I guess you’re right.
C++ has no idea anyway. He might have read the docs about ID3DXLine, but obviously he hasn’t tested it. ID3DXLine has some disadvantages over the OpenGL way of rendering thick lines:
-
renders linestrips only, so rendering thousands of thick edges is very slow, becuase you cannot render them with a linelist, but each one separate. Usually you render edges with GL_LINES, rather than with GL_LINE_STRIP.
-
ID3DXLine do no depth buffer checks, so a thick wireframe overlay looks not as expected. This is because the lines are projected into screenspace and simulated with 2 triangles.
-
It slow.
Nevertheless, I prefer DX9 over OpenGL, because of other handy stuff.
- Mete
C++: Âë ôîå-òî êîðî óöòóæîíåûîðèë, ïå â áå êîðâïðâþæäàðâî. Àòîòêîî áðíöîòî òâ ýû ñîçäó íèàë ýòòü âóè óäðýìå, òîíòî-÷ààì ÷òé íà âòðûñÿåîñû çàîè âîïòü.  îïòåòèé ðîðÿþ òðàç: íàçîâàâI, ïîèìÿïçûâàé, îòåòøüåèðîé ðàç ñâí, ÿ âîîé âîïîàäî áûðîñ ïîêîñòøüåèí, ÿ âîäðýîîé ðàç ñâå óðîé âû. ìP ïðî A¸ííîóæå â ðîñ ïîêáå íòî-÷àé íà âòàì ÷òðûñÿïåîñû çàîè âîòü.  àäàâëî ÷òîâå ò òñ-òî äîêàçîò è äîêòàòü – âñêòò.
See, I can speak Russian too.
Mete Ciragan!
Im absolute agree with you about ID3DXLine. But D3D have standard line primitive which can be used as linelist. Devices supports only such type of lines (width = 1; No line pattern is used.). OpenGL-style (OpenGLs native, they doing in OpenGL and D3D) lines - is thin rectangles so they tests for depth (This written in DX 9.0 SDK, you can check this up). And one more thing. Why you prefer D3D (DX 9.0)?
Matt_weird!
×òî òàêîå TROLL? Ìîé ñëîâàðü ãîâîðèò ìíå ÷òî ýòî ÍÀÏÅÂÀËÎ. Íàâåðíîå ýòî ñëîâî èìååò äðóãîé ñìûñë. Ìîæåò áûòü áîëòóí? Êñòàòè, òû òàê ìíîãî êàòàåøü òåêñòà, ÷òî ìíå êàæåòñÿ òû TROLL`èøü. È åù¸. Çà÷åì èì íóæíû moderators?
Âîò îíè, ãåðîè, ïèøóò èñòèíó:
Ìîé âîïðîñ â ôîðóì:
Èíòåðåñíî, êàêîé ãðàôè÷åñêèé ñòàíäàðò ðàáîòàåò áûñòðåå: Direct3D èëè OpenGL?
Âîò åñëè, íàïðèìåð, ïîñìîòðåòü êîëè÷åñòâî FPS â Unreal Tournament ïîä Direct3D, à çàòåì ïîä OpenGL, ÷èñëà ïîëó÷àþòñÿ îäèíàêîâûå (ïî÷òè, Direct3D ÷óòü áûñòðåå) ïðè óñëîâèè, ÷òî óñòàíîâêè ãðàôèêè îäíè è òå æå (WxHxBPP è ò.ä.) è ìû âèäèì â òî÷íîñòè òó æå ÷àñòü ñöåíû (òî æå ïîëîæåíèå, òîò æå óãîë îáçîðà è ò.ä.). Ìàëî òîãî, ãðàôè÷åñêèå îøèáêè ïîëíîñòüþ ïîâòîðÿþòñÿ (Ãäå ïîä D3D âîçíèêàëè êîíôëèêòû ãëóáèíû, òàì è ïîä OpenGL, and more, more, more…)! Êàê òàêîå ìîæåò áûòü???
Îòâåò1:
Òóò óæå äåëî íå â àïè à â æåëåçå, ïðîáëåìû âîçíèêàþò íà óðîâíå æåëåçà, òàê ÷òî íå âàæíî ÷òî òû èñïîëüçóåøü…
Îòâåò2:
Äåëî â òîì, ÷òî âèäåîàäàïòåðû íå ïîääåðæèâàþò OpenGL íàïðÿìóþ íà àïïàðàòíîì óðîâíå. Ïîääåðæêà îñóùåñòâëÿåòñÿ ïîñðåäñòâîì äðàéâåðîâ HAL. Òàê, ÷òî äàííûå, ïîñûëàåìûå API`øíûìè ôóíêöèÿìè ïðåîáðàçóþòñÿ äðàéâåðàìè â ðîäíîé äëÿ âèäåîàäàïòåðà ôîðìàò. Èìåííî ïîýòîìó íå óäàåòñÿ äîñòè÷ü ìàêñèìàëüíûõ ïîêàçàòåëåé
ïðîèçâîäèòåëüíîñòè, óêàçûâàåìûõ ïðîèçâîäèòåëåì. Direct3D ðàáîòàåò íåìíîãî áûñòðåå, ò.ê. ýòî áîëåå “íèçêîóðîâíåâûé” ñòàíäàðò.