Since I don’t know much about the structure of DX10, someone else with more knowledge might be able to enlighten me about the complexity of making a wrapper for DX10, on top of OpenGL (etc).
The goal would be, of course, to be able to run DX10 titles without Vista (e.g. on XP, or perhaps even under Wine).
I know DX8 is available under Wine - and it works fairly well in my experience. Perhaps that code could be used as a base?
I’ve written an abstraction layer for my engine renderer to work with D3D10, basically adopting D3D10 featureset/structures, it wasn’t difficult, althoughat the time some extensions were missing so I couldn’t cover all D3D10 features with OpenGL.
(Now the required extensions are available.)
How to load the proper DLL and all might be more difficult. (Especially since D3D9 tend to have several release for the same version with updated DLLs with another name, that would mean updating the project as often as D3D10 get updates.)
Wine have already integrated big parts of Direct3D9 and shortly started with Direct3D 10 as a google summer of code project .
The guys from Falling Leaf systems working on such a project  called “Alky Project”. Don’t bother to download the pre alpha preview. The only thing that currently works correct is clearing the screen. The reason for this may that they use only fixed functions yet.
I am played with the idea by my own . One of the bigger problems is the binary encoding of the shader and effects files. They are not documented at all but the core API will only see these as it is still recommend to compile shaders and effects on the developer side and only distribute the binary versions.
You should wait until Longs Peak and Mt Evans come out before attempting this.
I agree that Long Peaks and Mount Evans should make the resource handling easier. But there are enough parts in such a wrapper that don’t depend on the resource handling at all.
You could already implement:
- the effect framework
- the shader reflection
- state block management
- The binary SM 4 to GLSL converter. ( I assume that LP und ME will still use GLSL)
LP or ME would not change anything to the “bigger problem” of reverse-engineering these binary shaders.
EDIT: Demirug was faster than me
From what I understand, part of the Alky project is to reverse-engineer the shader code - has it already been done?
Nice to see that the D3D10 project has been approved as a Google Summer of Code project! Perhaps some nice things will happen.
Demirug, nice work with your wrapper!
I actually did a Glide wrapper on top of OpenGL some years ago (Remember Glide?..). It was never really finished (who would need it anyway…), but I could actually play a few games.
I guess wrapping DX10 is a completely different and more complex issue, but some things are most likely similar - such as not being able to make a 1:1 mapping, at least not with full hardware support.
Wow, I thought everyone was dead
Hehe… developing with Glide was bittersweet. On the one hand it was wonderful to have acceleration at all, yet on the other it was often sensitive to how polygons were clipped and projected, and sessions tended to end rather unceremoniously in the obligatory 3-fingered salute
I think the only game I ever played with direct Glide support was Unreal, which also supported GL and DX, but if memory serves Glide was the most stable of the 3 (until my card went up in smoke).
Yes, I remember clocking my Voodoo3 until I got rather wicked snowy triangles in Unreal. Really cool game at the time, b.t.w. The best reason to buy a Voodoo card.
…unspeakably good thing that Carmack came along and pushed OpenGL over Glide (if I remember correctly Direct3D wasn’t even invented at that time?).
at the time of the voodoo3??? course it was invented - version 3 or something. D3D was even supported on my old Matrox Mystique, the card with the worst poly rasterizing acceleration ever made.
glide was horrible, I used the minigl driver for my voodoo2. getprocaddress,getprocaddress,getprocaddress…
All thanks to carmack.
Yup it was invented, and if Carmack hadn’t stood up to Alex St. John’s unmitigated bull**** we’d all be stuck with D3D and it wouldn’t have tried very hard to improve much over version 4 (which if memory serves was the big revision to clean things up).
D3D as you may know started out as RenderMorphics’ software engine, which was a rather decent retained mode software engine. Microsoft bought the company and unfortunately simply exposed the internals, the rest is history.
The current D3D crisis is that DirectX 10 is only deployable on Vista, so it’s basically dead in the water thanks to an artificial strategy of Microsoft’s to promote Vista by holding XP back, because nobody is going to use D3D 10 as the primary target until people migrate from XP (which just isn’t happening). Worse, Vista desktop is actually based on DirectX 9.0 so even on Vista you’re not guaranteed 10.0 you’ll pretty much have a 9.0 “Vista Capable” platforms in a LOT of systems out there.
So now we get to wait and see where the dust settles on the latest episode of Microsoft’s control freakery. It would suck if you’d just invested in DirectX 10 technology and it can’t even be exposed on most gaming platforms in the market because Microsoft is screwing everyone’s pooch.
At least OpenGL will not be held back by Microsoft’s marketing. The hardware vendors have not yet been robbed of wglGetProcAddress.
But so far, OpenGL was held back by the ISV/IHV, so no advantage here…
I am very intrigued if AMD/ATI will support the new SM4 extensions for their new cards… I haven’t seen any notice on their website.
AFAIK, ATI has new OpenGL driver for Vista (built from scratch), and they have plan to put this driver for XP too but later. When? I dont know… Maybe this year. Right now, ATI have two OpenGL drivers, for XP and for Vista. Both drivers have bugs (or features?) but know workarounds on XP will not work on Vista.
ATI, the Vauxhall of graphics cards.