Columbia (not OT)

I think we need to gain a little perspective here. Its only 7 ppl, that all knew the risks they were taking in the 1st place.

More children die every minute from starvation. I think the only reason its all over the news soo much, is because its a blow to America’s pride.

Originally posted by Nutty:
[b]I think we need to gain a little perspective here. Its only 7 ppl, that all knew the risks they were taking in the 1st place.

More children die every minute from starvation. I think the only reason its all over the news soo much, is because its a blow to America’s pride.

[/b]

Not many people will disagree with that, because it is a fact that occurs every year, year after year. There are many reasons to hate America (hate Canada as well if you wish, I’m canadian actually)

But understand this. The NASA represents something worthwhile for some of us. It shouldn’t be just about america. It’s international.

Some people here seem to be saying “who cares”

Why dont you complain about Pakistan’s nuclear tests. How many poor people are over there?
What about China? They were planning to build a nuclear submarrine with the aid of french engineers. The engineers were killed. China also has a space program you know.

The list of human stupiditity goes on.

Originally posted by V-man:
The list of human stupiditity goes on.

It sure does.
COLUMBIA is (was) on the other list, along with OPENGL, which was the purpose of this thread.

Originally posted by Coriolis:
I liked this board and the people on it, until this thread showed the character of so many of the posters. Can’t you take your petty political differences and hatred of America someplace more appropriate than a tribute to the recently deceased? Would you interrupt a eulogy to say that it was too flattering or one-sided anywhere except under the anonymous safety of a messageboard? If you disapprove, at least have the decency to stay out of this thread. Make an “America sucks and Bush is a warmongering fool” thread for all I care, and complain to your heart’s content in there.

If I don’t agree with you, I’m your enemy, right? Get a grip, mate.

Originally posted by Coriolis:
I liked this board and the people on it, until this thread showed the character of so many of the posters. Can’t you take your petty political differences and hatred of America someplace more appropriate than a tribute to the recently deceased? Would you interrupt a eulogy to say that it was too flattering or one-sided anywhere except under the anonymous safety of a messageboard? If you disapprove, at least have the decency to stay out of this thread. Make an “America sucks and Bush is a warmongering fool” thread for all I care, and complain to your heart’s content in there.

I’m pretty disgusted that you seem to be playing down the importance of the current political climate, Coriolis. Your passionate defense of a thread aimed at giving tribute to the death of 7 priviliged people is inappropriate, if you ask me. You should direct some of that anger towards your own government, just as I have been doing towards my own government (UK).
This whole ‘unpleasantness’ in the gulf is far more sinistar and significant than you seem to realise, and about as relevant to the columbia accident as this thread is to opengl.

[This message has been edited by knackered (edited 02-02-2003).]

You know, this is the main reason why people don’t frequent this board more often. No moderator to take care of these things.

By skimming through all that above, which is mostly just BS, we can say that we agree to disagree, and some of you seem to be lacking oxygen or something.

Put a fork in it, this thread should be dead.

The grief over 7 astronauts has nothing to do with American pride taking a blow. It’s a human tragedy. When Princess Dianna died it was one person but Britain was irrationally shocked, all other nations have similar examples of national figures dying.

Grief is not a matter of simple arithmetic, to think it is, is inhuman.

These Astornauts died in a great endeavour taking significant risks and representing the people of the US and the world. They were well known and highly accomplished individuals who aspired to do great things beyond the capabilities of most of us. For all these reasons their loss resonates with people in the US and elsewhere.

If you don’t understand this, you’re a fool. Don’t post again it was only seven, that’s already been said and we don’t need further evidence of another callous fool who needs to live a few more years and learn a few more lessons. If a member of your family or someone close died it’d only be one, but you’d care disproportionately to the numbers. This has nothing to do with the numbers, or pride.

You would describe what you’re feeling as grief, dorbie?

I wouldn’t say I’m grieving greatly, but I respect the right of others to do so without throwning arithmetic in their face and citing the deaths of others to discount their feelings. I was shocked to see the shuttle disintegrate. I care about the space program and respect those who risk their lives. My thoughts are with the relatives who were waiting to celebrate the pinnacle of their loved one’s life achivements only to lose them in an instant, forever. I can see the human tragedy and why this is such a terrible thing for anyone who cares to pay attention. If there is such a thing as collective grief (I can’t think of a better word) then I suppose this is it.

[This message has been edited by dorbie (edited 02-02-2003).]

speaking about diana heres a couple of lines from a song i wrote on her deathday (very pertinent to the columbia disaster WRT the media)

A C#m G Bm (sung in prince style falsetto)

(censored)

it was then the largest ever watched tv spectacular,
watch by an audience numbering in the idiots.
i said oh my lord this cant be true i must be living in a world fools.


ill post some thoughts on related issues on my website later on, including the reason why the disaster happened.

main cause -> the tiles (which were never a good idea when youre travelling at X 1000’s of k/hr)
(not enuf flour + water)

Where would the world be without your genius?

Originally posted by zed:

A C#m G Bm

Sorry, zed, but this sounds like crap. How are you supposed to play it? After all, it’s coming from “prolly the greatest composer alive at the moment”

Peace to the memory of these brave men.

-Ilkka

It’s a human tragedy. When Princess Dianna died it was one person but Britain was irrationally shocked, all other nations have similar examples of national figures dying.

Well again I thought this was stupid, IMHO. Hardly anyone knew her, yet they lined the streets like it was everyones own sister that died.

They were well known

No they weren’t. Perhaps to ppl following the space industry, but I couldn’t even name one of them. And the majority of ppl in this world wouldn’t be able to either.

If a member of your family or someone close died it’d only be one, but you’d care disproportionately to the numbers.

I’d care because I knew them! And it would be a great loss to me personally. Losing 7 astronauts I’d never heard of before isn’t.

I just hate this attitude of being expected to grieve for no reason. Do you grieve everytime someone on the opposite side of the world is killed without reason? If we all had to grieve everytime someone we didn’t know died, we’d never get anything done.

Its a sad loss to ppl they knew and loved. Its not to everyone else. Get a grip.

You know, this is the main reason why people don’t frequent this board more often. No moderator to take care of these things.

[PLUG]My boards are moderated [/PLUG]

>>Where would the world be without your genius?<<

pretty much in the same place i expect

btw hey i thought u werent gonna post anymore

i noticed this today http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/2720631.stm
not fully proven yet (but i expect this will be the final cause)
as ive said since the 80s the tiles are not a good idea,
mainly cause when youre travelling a thousands of km’s per hour u want a surface made of one piece + not composed of a myraid of smaller pieces
also theyre stuck on with ‘flour + water’

Originally posted by dorbie:
[b]I wouldn’t say I’m grieving greatly, but I respect the right of others to do so without throwning arithmetic in their face and citing the deaths of others to discount their feelings. I was shocked to see the shuttle disintegrate. I care about the space program and respect those who risk their lives. My thoughts are with the relatives who were waiting to celebrate the pinnacle of their loved one’s life achivements only to lose them in an instant, forever. I can see the human tragedy and why this is such a terrible thing for anyone who cares to pay attention. If there is such a thing as collective grief (I can’t think of a better word) then I suppose this is it.

[This message has been edited by dorbie (edited 02-02-2003).][/b]

i can see the same human tragecy in the ones that died in the train accident, in car accidents, in bombs in israel, etc. they all had families, they all had moments to celebrate, some of them came from work and wanted to announce some big change in live, like getting a bether job, or finishing a long project. who knows? who cares? the families do. the friends do. the coworkers do. and so does currently the NASA. but the rest has nothing to care about that. nobody cares about any human, but any human is great in his live, and does not earn to die.

say to see more in that event is simply utterly stupid. you bitch on the other humans that died, you state they don’t count, you state that those astronauts where bether humans. if they would still live, you could ask them if they are bether humans than the ones died in the train, than the ones bombed in israel, the childs died due hunger, etc. they would for sure support your oppinion “yes, we are bether than those”.

think again. you’re quite racistic (by using the word in the wrong position as its not about a race, but it shows the idea…).

Dave, your top quote is correct but the rest of your post is an irrational and outrageous lie. The things you claim I support, think or even say (you even have the gall to put some things in quotes) are false. (I think you’re confusing your posters from a thread on 9-11, which I never posted to). Your powers for mind reading and rational thought have failed you again.

It is self evident that people care about the events close to their lives and that affected them. The Shuttle is internationally recognized, the astronauts are famous to millions. I’ve personally seen several shuttle launches at the Kenedy space center, undoubtedly one of the most awe inspiring experiences unimaginable. I’ve visited and worked with United Space Alliance and others on shuttle simulator issues in Houston (the ones used to train the Astronauts), and worked with other parts of NASA on other graphics issues. I take pride in my small contributions. There are millions like me, most even closer to the space program.

When Challenger blew up, almost every US schoolkid was assembled and watching live on TVs in assembly halls all over the country. It was a national education program promoted by NASA, there was the first school teacher astronaut on board. For them this brings back those memories of being ushered out of those halls in shock and silence.

I have tried to explain why this resonates with people, why they are close and why they care. You chose not to listen, instead accusing me of the very things you are guilty of, and putting the words of others in my mouth.

Dave, I know you are an anti-american bogot from your rambling offline emails to me, incomprehensibly accusing America of things like “causing every war last century”.

Your bigotry does not give you a passport to accuse me of racism. If you’re looking for bigotry then look in the mirror.

[This message has been edited by dorbie (edited 02-04-2003).]

This might be getting a little out of hand here.

The death of the brave men and women on that shuttle is utterly tragic. I woke up, and got told by my dad (i’m 17…still at home) to turn the TV on. When i found out about what had happened, i didn’t just feel sad, i had a shiver run down my spine.

The reason, in my opinion, that events like this take over the media goes beyond the tragic death of the astronauts. The death of them is as sad as the death of any other human being, but this was a blow to the country also. At some level, we have placed a certain amount of hope on the space program. Seeing a space shuttle fly into space is an almost patriotic burst of feelings. Likewise, the explosion of one is as damaging and startling as events like that on September 11th.

This isn’t about people being respected over others.

With that, I hope that the souls of the crew from the Columbia rest in peace. They are nothing short of heros for the grave sacrifices they made to better life for all their fellow humans.

  • Halcyon

Well said Halcyon, I think you make a good point that should be emphasized, I wish I could have been half as elloquent earlier. Respect for the tragic loss of one group does not mean disrespect nor disregard for another. You lose what you thought you once had, you miss those you feel the most connected to the most, for whatever reason. To do so is human.

http://www-pao.ksc.nasa.gov/kscpao/shuttle/summaries/pdf/sts107memo.pdf

>>The reason, in my opinion, that events like this take over the media goes beyond the tragic death of the astronauts. The death of them is as sad as the death of any other human being, but this was a blow to the country also. At some level, we have placed a certain amount of hope on the space program.<<

(im guessing out my ass) but i believe the % of gdp that goes to space research in the us is even less than what goes to foreign aid
the kiwi government is also guilty of the same thing (not space of course) theyre willing to get the praise when something is achieved but are not willing to put money into it in the first place (hmm could of phrased that better)

>>They are nothing short of heros for the grave sacrifices they made to better life for all their fellow humans.<<

thats exactlly what i think when im doing my job (stuck up a ladder picking apples) cause

A/ it could kill me (ive been lucky sofar)
B/ im providing healthy food for my fellow humans.

cheers haycon yourve made my day.